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Ducks Beat Oilers 5-0, Fans Hoping For Management Change, Not Another Episode Of "Oil Change"

I'm not sure how this man still has a job in the NHL. I know if I were an owner that wanted to win and the man who was in charge of making that happened failed as miserably as Tambellini has, I would fire him. While everyone argued against sending Taylor Hall back to Windsor or Ryan Nugent-Hopkins back to Red Deer because it would "poison the well", this man has created a perennial losing atmosphere.

This man insisted on a culture change and since doing so has fired a coach, a trainer, an assistant trainer, an equipment manager, a fitness trainer, a minor league coach, and a scout. And the team keeps losing.

This man is the mastermind behind a last-place cap team. He's the mastermind behind this year's defense. He's the mastermind behind Nikolai Khabibulin's contract. It's time to stop defending this man and send him back to his job as Assistant to the Traveling Secretary.

Team GP W L OL PTS Proj PTS
New York Islanders 41 15 20 6 36 72
Edmonton Oilers 43 16 23 4 36 69
Carolina Hurricanes 45 15 23 7 37 67
Anaheim Ducks 43 14 22 7 35 67
Columbus Blue Jackets 43 12 26 5 29 55

Oh yeah, the Oilers, a team purposefully built with no defense and not enough NHL players by this man, even though he didn't know that, played like crap and lost 5-0 to the 29th-place Ducks.

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http://twitter.com/GenePrincipe/status/158056268056109057

Hey, cool. The guy finally realizing who his good players are.

Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.

by Derek Zona on Jan 13, 2012 10:26 PM MST reply actions  

Well put, Mr. Renney. And I love that he singled out Gagner and Hemsky – was that not a shot across the bow of the local media?

by Chunklets on Jan 13, 2012 10:35 PM MST up reply actions  

What would anyone who wanders into these comments trade away to make sure that Lowe and Tambellini were gone forever?

Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.

by Derek Zona on Jan 13, 2012 10:37 PM MST reply actions  

That’s a very good question. My sort of knee-jerk response is “not much, without knowing who would replace them,” but I’d need to think about it, and I will.

by Chunklets on Jan 13, 2012 10:45 PM MST up reply actions  

Like I said before I would deal one of RNH or Hall if that’s what it takes. It’s that bad.

by RiversQ on Jan 14, 2012 9:53 AM MST via iPhone app up reply actions   1 recs

I saw this pop into my Google Reader, and the preview pane just said “Fire Steve Tambellini”, and I just completely lost it.

http://sacrificethebody.blogspot.com/
Sacrifice the Body - Examining the NHL through statistical analysis, reasoned thought, and blind conjecture.

by IAmJoe on Jan 13, 2012 10:41 PM MST reply actions   1 recs

Remember when “getting tough” was going to save the franchise?

Now the team has tough guys that don’t to jack. Seems like yet another management issue.

https://twitter.com/Lord_Bob/status/158055147979800576

Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.

by Derek Zona on Jan 13, 2012 10:49 PM MST reply actions  

bbbbut, the oilers have to deal with INJURIES damn you.

by till_horcoff_is_coach on Jan 13, 2012 10:49 PM MST reply actions  

I just don’t know what to say any more. This team is terrible and the worst part is that it was predictable. Inneptitude like this should be unacceptable and yet it seems like the plan right now. As a paying customer I’ve had enough, tomorrow I’m picking the few games I still want to still see this season and the rest I’m selling off.

Everyone knows rock attained perfection in 1974. It's a scientific fact.
Writer for The Copper & Blue and a frequenter of the time waster that is Twitter.

by ryanbatty on Jan 14, 2012 12:07 AM MST via mobile reply actions  

Hope you’re not expecting face value.

Oilers fan through thick, thin and anorexic. Writer for The Cult of Hockey.

by Bruce McCurdy on Jan 14, 2012 12:59 PM MST up reply actions  

there are games you want to go to?

by Passive Voice on Jan 14, 2012 9:20 PM MST up reply actions  

Remember when signing Belanger was going to turn Horcoff into a prince?

Who knew?

by Traktor on Jan 14, 2012 12:11 AM MST reply actions  

Belanger has been a significant disappointment this season. I tought that he’d be a much better player. I don’t know exactly what you mean by turning Horcoff into a prince, but I did think he’d take some pressure off Horcoff for DZ and PK responsibilities, and that hasn’t really happened. The PK is using six forwards this year instead of four, but Horcoff’s ice time is actually up, and the relief that Belanger has provided in the DZ has been used to help out Nugent-Hopkins (when in lineup), which is probably a very good choice.

The biggest fanana of the Havana Bananas.

by Scott Reynolds on Jan 14, 2012 8:39 AM MST up reply actions  

Trak, you lost the Horcoff argument six years ago. It’s over, dude.

by RiversQ on Jan 14, 2012 9:55 AM MST via iPhone app up reply actions   2 recs

I am sick of Oilers losing too, but are people being a bit results oriented from today’s game? We finally outshoot a team 33-28, 64% on the faceoff dot. Just a bad penalty kill today and poor goaltending. Maybe scoring chances weren’t reflected in shots, and possibly people angry because Anaheim is near us in standings, so there was expectation to win.

I still wholeheartedly agree in Tambellini let to walk at end of season as I am still confused as to the positives he can point out next to Jones off waivers, Potter, and a gift in Smyth. If I remember him correctly, he said he expected Oilers to compete this year, and challenge for the playoffs. While unrealistic to many of us, if this is the standard he expected, he should be judged to this expectation.

by George Roop on Jan 14, 2012 12:58 AM MST reply actions  

but are people being a bit results oriented from today’s game?

Oh yeah. I thought things were going along swimmingly until last night.

Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.

by Derek Zona on Jan 14, 2012 8:13 AM MST up reply actions  

Obviously this is true, just don’t understand why this game is the one is the straw that breaks the camel’s back. Maybe I am seeing a different game, but I thought the Oilers played half decent in what turned out to be a blowout loss.

by George Roop on Jan 14, 2012 1:00 PM MST up reply actions  

Back in the summer, a former co-worker & I were talking hockey. He knew my passion for this team. Our conversation:

Him: “The Oilers are gonna be a lot better this year with all the sophomores, RNH, Hemsky, Gagner, Whitney, etc. I can see them getting in the playoffs. How do you think they’ll do this year, man?”

Me: “They’re gonna be just as bad as last year, but probably not dead last. Swiss cheese defence, pestilential goaltending and a totally clueless GM. All wrapped up in an Edmonton Media that tows the Organizational Line to maintain the facade (and their jobs).”

Damn I hate being right sometimes!

by painfulloss on Jan 14, 2012 1:13 AM MST reply actions   1 recs

apologies, my main account is giving me issues.

I truly feel bad for you guys. not most edmonton fans, but you guys at the copper and blue and in the oilogosphere specifically.

the discourse and intelligent thought that passes through this site makes me wonder just how large the gap between management and a blogger can be. tambo has no concept of asset management, signs horrible deals, lets media influence him (unlike in calgary, where that’s vice-versa) and trades difference-makers for peanuts.

you guys do deserve a better team and a better management group. hopefully you get it soon. a team with this much talent shouldn’t have this little depth.

It's Like The Empire Strikes Back of Commenting.

by Justin Azevedo 2 on Jan 14, 2012 3:10 AM MST reply actions   1 recs

I truly feel bad for you guys. not most edmonton fans, but you guys at the copper and blue and in the oilogosphere specifically.

I’d love to see an independent survey, but I believe most Edmonton fans believe in the rebuild (either v 1.5 or v 2.2) whole-heartedly. Given the amount of twitter traffic and excitement about a 3rd #1 overall, I bet it’s an enormous percentage.

Those people still blame Horcoff, Hemsky and Gilbert for this team.

Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.

by Derek Zona on Jan 14, 2012 9:00 AM MST up reply actions  

Those people still blame Horcoff, Hemsky and Gilbert for this team.

In a perfect world, there could be two clone Edmonton Oiler franchises.. one specifically for those same people, where they could be subjected to the incredible torture of trying to cheer for an Oilers team with a Tambo management clique that trades those 3 away…

by Trites on Jan 14, 2012 11:34 AM MST up reply actions  

Lowe, Tambel, Reny

Kevin Lowe forgot what made his NHL career and the team great. Good owner, manager and coach. The oilers get outcoached in every game………………… Now the “Lame Duck Oilers” have been embare assed by the Disney Ducks. And you guys are still buying tickets to see management secure the next top draft they can screw up next year. What a laugher you idiots are…

by FilipineFan on Jan 14, 2012 4:45 AM MST reply actions  

Rebuild.

What’s a rebuild anyways? Sucking for 3 or 4 years straight without any improvement besides the #1 pick every year? Seems like a robot could be the GM.

In fact, this seems to be getting worse, no?

Dynasty of futility.

Brett Gee

by Brett Gee on Jan 14, 2012 5:21 AM MST reply actions   1 recs

I think the coach needs to go more than the GM. I think Nelson would be a pretty good next guy, and he is a Tambellini hire.

It is still Lowe’s old buddies in professional scouting.

But if Tambellini is fired, it will be because he made a bad choice (Renney) to coach.

by godot10 on Jan 14, 2012 8:23 AM MST reply actions  

I think it hurts him significantly that Renney is his second hire for head coach. A GM can almost always survive firing one coach, but two is getting dicey.

The biggest fanana of the Havana Bananas.

by Scott Reynolds on Jan 14, 2012 8:32 AM MST up reply actions  

Look at the date of that hire. Sutter wasn’t around last July 1, or the July 1 before that.

Lowe’s good trades were all before 2006. He and the professional scouts were a disaster post-2006. Rob Daum saw O’Sullivan good when he coached him in the minors, which is why he is probably no longer with the Oilers. They brought in Hemsky’s buddy Kotaliik. Katz brought in Comrie for detente reasons in the Edmonton business community. The “get-rid-of-Penner/Heatley” stuff clearly comes from MacT not wanting the player. The dumping of Glencross and Hejda preceded Tambellini. MacT praised Nilsson, and essentially chose Nilsson over Glencross.

The medical staff that cleared the Whitney deal are gone. And there are reports that Lowe insisted on an “established” NHL player for Visnovsky, rather than prospects/picks.

Tambellini has been a very good GM at dumping contracts for picks….Staios, Grebeshkov (who would have had to quality at over $3 million to keep), Garon.

Tambellini, as an incoming GM, had the disadvantage that his predecessor was still around, and could not clean house immediately.

Can you point out something good that the professional scouts did after 2006?

by godot10 on Jan 14, 2012 9:03 AM MST up reply actions  

What is the purview of a professional scout in the Oilers’ organization?

What event caused four men, all, accoring to yourself, successful professional scouts to all simultaneously fail?

What makes more sense:
1. Lowe was either good or lucky and stopped being lucky at trades and signings, and Tambellini just takes the pipe on both every time

OR

2. Four extremely successful men simultaneously fell apart?

The answer is pretty obvious.

Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.

by Derek Zona on Jan 14, 2012 9:31 AM MST up reply actions  

Lowe gained access to money to spend on players, and he and his friends lost their edge, just like Sather did when he first went to NY. They eased up. They thought they were now on a level playing field and had to stop using their brains.

Money makes you stupid. See Darcy Regier in Buffalo. One of the smartest GM’s for the last decade goes crazy overnight.

Like I said. The choice of Renney may get Tambellini fired, but other than that, in the areas where he has had control, over the farm, and getting extra picks for MacGregor, he has been more than decent.

by godot10 on Jan 14, 2012 9:40 AM MST up reply actions  

Also, so you would have never fired Barry Fraser? He had the three best draft years consecutively pretty much ever, and then fired off about 15 years of complete duds.

by godot10 on Jan 14, 2012 12:00 PM MST up reply actions  

Tough to point out anything either good or bad since pro scouts don’t make any final decisions. That’s the GM’s job. That said, yes, the team did make some good moves under Lowe in 2006-07 and 2007-08 (the acquisitions of Visnovsky, Pitkanen, Glencross, Hejda, and Grebeshkov were all good in my opinion).

The biggest fanana of the Havana Bananas.

by Scott Reynolds on Jan 14, 2012 9:34 AM MST up reply actions  

But Lowe overpaid Grebeshkov, making him impossible to keep.

MacT didn’t like Glencross or Hejda or Pitkanen or Penner.

by godot10 on Jan 14, 2012 9:43 AM MST up reply actions  

But weren’t we talking about pro scouting?

The biggest fanana of the Havana Bananas.

by Scott Reynolds on Jan 14, 2012 1:43 PM MST up reply actions  

Documenting the Voyage

MacT praised Nilsson, and essentially chose Nilsson over Glencross.

I don’t think so. MacT foresaw Nilsson skating on the LW with Horcoff & Hemsky. Glencross would’ve fit elsewhere. I think the consensus hereabouts is correct. The Oilers chose to chase shiny baubles rather than negotiate intelligently with Glencross.

It was the coaching staff who espied Glencross. Specifically, Daum noticed him while prepping for an upcoming match against the Blue Jackets.

They brought in Hemsky’s buddy Kotaliik

I know many disagree, but I thought that worked. The problem was that the Rangers offered him $3 million per during The Frenzy.

Grebeshkov (who would have had to quality at over $3 million to keep),

Man, they sure could use Grebeshkov about now.

by Mr DeBakey on Jan 14, 2012 9:54 AM MST up reply actions   1 recs

Ryan Jones, Corey Potter. It’s hard but there is a couple

by Peacecountry on Jan 14, 2012 12:14 PM MST via mobile up reply actions  

If Tambellini is unable to fire them for whatever reason, he should lose his job… If Tambellini fires Tom Renney, his second coaching hire, he should be fired.

So Tambellini should be fired if he doesn’t fire his professional scouts, and he should be fired if he does fire his coach.

Oilers fan through thick, thin and anorexic. Writer for The Cult of Hockey.

by Bruce McCurdy on Jan 14, 2012 3:10 PM MST up reply actions  

Yes, thank you for following along.

Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.

by Derek Zona on Jan 15, 2012 7:41 AM MST up reply actions  

This title is absolutely fantastic.

The biggest fanana of the Havana Bananas.

by Scott Reynolds on Jan 14, 2012 8:32 AM MST reply actions  

But...

we’re so young and exciting. Hall, Gagner, Omark, MPS and RNH… we’re going to be so good!! This is exactly what Chicago and Pittsburgh did! We’re right on track. All we need is a few more teenagers and we’ll be set to win the World Junior, er, Stanley Cup. Penalty Killers, Dman, veterans and Goalies will eventually just fall out of the trees in Edmonton… we don’t need to worry about those cause we’re young and exciting!

by Czechboy on Jan 14, 2012 9:08 AM MST reply actions  

And fans want to get rid of Horcoff and Hemsky.

Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.

by Derek Zona on Jan 14, 2012 9:31 AM MST up reply actions  

I can’t tell if this was brilliantly crafted sarcasm or a cry for help.

Cynically Sarcastic
Сертыфікаваны Grabbo Палюбоўнік

by clrkaitken on Jan 14, 2012 9:35 AM MST up reply actions  

Zona wrote an article a year ago (or more) about the Chicago rebuild and how they added to a strong core by signing people like Hossa and pointing out how many players were in their mid 20’s and NHL players. Currently, the Oil have done neither of those things and want to get rid of all our NHLers to get more non NHLers. I firmly believe we are following the Columbus/Florida/NY Islander model. I’m of the opinion that, with a few easy trades, waiver pickups and simple signings we could be competitive today while still building around our awesome core of youth. For instance, when Jagr came in he had Jiri Hrdina to help him. Ron Francis, Paul Coffey and Mario all veterans by that point… seemless transition. More recently, Seguin has come in to have Recchi (last year), Chara, Krejci and an assortment of great players and is now going to the All Star game. We just throw our young guys to the wolves and ‘hope’ we build a winning environment around them. I really don’t think it would be rocket science to make this Oil team competitive. We should’ve traded Khabi when he was hot. Signed two more mid level D man. The ONLY signing I liked was Belanger (which hasn’t worked out but it was a good signing at the time).

I’d kill to get Nashville’s management in Edmonton… give me Poille and Trotz asap. They make the playoffs every year without a superstar forward, lose their starting Goalie every few years (but always have another one ready) and come in under the cap every year but are always competitive. Our model is apparantly to keep losing and then WHAM Stanley cup.

by Czechboy on Jan 14, 2012 10:46 AM MST up reply actions  

You talk about the ‘07-’08 Blackhawks here, but what about the ‘03-’04 Blackhawks? Or the ‘05-’06 Blackhawks. Those teams were awful. But they also gave significant minutes to Duncan Keith and Brent Seabrook to hone their talents and, in the case of ‘05-’06, use their draft position to select their franchise player. Isn’t that exactly what the Oilers are doing now with RNH, Eberle, and Hall getting top pp minutes and playing in late-game situations?

The team ST inherited was god awful. MacTavish’s coaching ability helped overcome some of the talent deficiency the Oilers suffered post- Smyth and Pronger, but aside from Horcoff, Hemsky, Souray, Visnovsky, and Gilbert there was just a bunch of kids and some AHL players disguised as NHL’ers.

by John Chambers on Jan 14, 2012 1:01 PM MST up reply actions  

The team Tambellini inherited also included Grebeshkov, Cole, and Penner (as well as Staios, Moreau, and Pisani).

The biggest fanana of the Havana Bananas.

by Scott Reynolds on Jan 14, 2012 1:50 PM MST up reply actions  

This is the team that Steve Tambellini gave Tom Renney? Have we even seen it? Is the problem more the GM or more the coach. That said, if the coach is back next year, I will turn on Tambellini too.

Smyth, Nugent-Hopkins, Eberle
Hall, Gagner, Hemsky
Paajarvi, Horcoff, Omark
Eager, Belanger, Jones
Hordichuk, Omarra, Hartikainen

The coach insisted on playing Belanger one line too high.

by godot10 on Jan 14, 2012 12:07 PM MST reply actions  

The funny part of this whole argument is that this team is going to be astonishingly amazing from 2015 to 2025. Hall, Hopkins, Eberle, and whoever we draft this upcoming June are all better and more elite talents than Doug Weight, Ryan Smyth, and Bill Guerin, or our top line the last time this team had any promise.

Indeed holes still need to be filled on D and in net, but if you look at Chicago’s re-build they also had a whole pile of crappy vets they tried to expedite re-build with – Martin Lapointe, Alexei Zhamnov, and even Khabibulin. That was not an expeditious path to salvation.

The problem with the Islanders and Blue Jackets is that they didn’t commit to last place for long enough. They grabbed Nash or Tavares or Kovalchuk and from there they sought to rise in the standings immediately. Pittsburgh and Washington stripped it down to the core and wallowed for a few years. Chicago drafted high in consecutive years by accident.

We’re almost there. Be glad we didn’t blow our load for James Wisniewski or Ville Leino. Tambi hasn’t done anything spectacular yet, but he hasn’t done anything catastrophic either. He inherited an awful team and made the right call to suck it up and tank it. How he improves on the core is how I choose to measure him.

by John Chambers on Jan 14, 2012 12:40 PM MST up reply actions  

Should I re-post my comment from the gamethread Derek?

by Kent Wilson on Jan 14, 2012 1:01 PM MST up reply actions  

The problem with the Islanders and Blue Jackets is that they didn’t commit to last place for long enough.

I think two years of finishing last entails enough “commitment” by our management. If any long term commitment is needed it’s to our managerial hierchy.

by BigB_09 on Jan 14, 2012 1:01 PM MST up reply actions  

Relax, it’s almost over. Use the time to learn to draw or play guitar or become a spectator of the NBA. I love this game!

by John Chambers on Jan 14, 2012 1:06 PM MST up reply actions  

I think, unless I’ve misunderstood something, the point of this thread is about mismanagement. So when you mention to be happy we didn’t sign Wisniewski or Leino… that would be an example of mismanagement. You also mention Khabibulin was a bad deal in Chicago 5 years ago… so how bad was it that we signed him for a similar term and more money in 2010? Also, nobody said Chicago did it overnight nor do I think the Oilers should either. We are in year 3 of this and still finishing last with little depth, good quality NHLers, lousy goaltending, shallow defensive depth. Hall, Eberle and RNH are fabulous cornerstones… when do we start building around them? Surrounding them with similar teenagers doesn’t make much sense to me.

by Czechboy on Jan 14, 2012 3:10 PM MST up reply actions  

You also mention Khabibulin was a bad deal in Chicago 5 years ago… so how bad was it that we signed him for a similar term and more money in 2010?

Khabibulin in Chicago: 4 years, $27 million
Khabibulin in Edmonton: 4 years, $15 million

… just for the record.

Oilers fan through thick, thin and anorexic. Writer for The Cult of Hockey.

by Bruce McCurdy on Jan 14, 2012 3:14 PM MST up reply actions  

So we got him for half his previous contract… should we consider that a ‘steal of a deal’?

by Czechboy on Jan 15, 2012 9:13 AM MST up reply actions  

Kevin Slowe

He’s the problem, look at the draft picks he missed (not made, although Riley Nash in 07 was a doozey)….we may have trouble unseating Columbus for the 30th spot…but the rest will be a cakewalk…I worry that the Kids won’t want to play for these clowns…dump Lowe and the rest will follow!

by Otiepitotie on Jan 14, 2012 12:37 PM MST reply actions  

This is the biggest thing

Just about anyone can make a top-five pick in the draft and get it right, but it takes a really good one to turn mid- and late-round choices into players who contribute to team success. That’s what a team really needs through rebuilding years, because keeping blue-chip prospects like Hall and Nugent-Hopkins around and under good contracts isn’t an easy task.

by Peter Raaymakers on Jan 14, 2012 12:59 PM MST up reply actions  

See Barker, Cam, Turris, Kyle, Hickey, Thomas, or go as far back as Stefan, Patrik. You can botch a high draft pick. You can’t, however, invent an elite team without them.

by John Chambers on Jan 14, 2012 1:04 PM MST up reply actions  

Rare cases indeed.

Okay, so I like losing as much as everyone else, but I’m also considerate of the fact that it’s what netted us Hall, RNH, and whatever other prize we’re going to unwrap in Ottawa this upcoming June. I also have a stomach for about another half-season of this garbage before I’ll advocate for drastic action that demands a competitive team to be iced immediately.

But what would you do? Given the circumstance two years ago (a crappy team and an injured Hemsky), tanking it for a couple of seasons was an ideal scenario to populate this team with elite talent that we haven’t seen in over a generation.

What would Derek Zona would’ve done differently, exactly, and remember if you attempted to field a more competitive team the last two seasons we would boast Cam Fowler and Sven Baertschi (sp) in our depth chart instead of Hall and RNH.

by John Chambers on Jan 14, 2012 1:18 PM MST up reply actions  

John: It`s isn`t really what Derek would have done but rather what the management team has done (Pre-Tambo-Post-Tambo), signed a 20 goal scorer (Horc) to a $33m contract, signed a 35 year old goaltender to a 4-year $15m contract, signed Cam Barker-period, acquired an injured Whitney…the list is extensive…personally I`m glad we tanked and got Hall and Nuge…but if there are no changes at the top, there will be no changes on the ice…smarter hockey people get results…Davidson in St. Louis, Talon in Florida, Poile in Nashville…``If you continue to do what you do-you continue to have what you have`` it`s as simple as that.

by Otiepitotie on Jan 14, 2012 1:36 PM MST up reply actions  

Rare cases indeed.

Winning through torching the team is just as rare.

Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.

by Derek Zona on Jan 14, 2012 3:45 PM MST up reply actions  

It’s not about individual moves. It’s about a deep understanding of percentages, markets, and being able to judge the talent level of his own team. Everything I would’ve done is out there for you look through. Tambellini didn’t understand the goalie market and overpaid Khabibulin by an enormous amount. Tambellini didn’t understand simple percentages and overpaid Gilbert Brule by an enormous amount. He terribly misjudged both the talent level and depth of his defense.

While it’s easy to tear apart what the guy has done wrong, it’s much easier to prove that this management group doesn’t understand any of the concepts of good management.

As for what I would have done – feel free to browse the archives – it’s all there.

Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.

by Derek Zona on Jan 14, 2012 4:01 PM MST up reply actions  

… and BAM!!! Stanley Cups.

Oilers fan through thick, thin and anorexic. Writer for The Cult of Hockey.

by Bruce McCurdy on Jan 14, 2012 4:14 PM MST up reply actions  

It’s a fair explanation. My point is that I agree with the overall strategy of drafting high as the platform to build a nucleus. But that can’t obviously be the panacea.

Although Tambi-cakes hasn’t surrounded the young talent with veterans or complimentary players, he hasn’t pulled any disasters by trading away key under-25 pieces, nor has the contracts that have been signed, ie our drunk Russian goaltender, really hindered our cap flexibility.

Like I say, I have a stomach for about a half-season’s more of this then I expect some drastic moves to engender a winning culture (Wideman & Zanon perhaps).

Enjoy reading C&B Derek. The analysis is fantastic, and the bitch-fests like these are entertaining. I’ll volunteer to supply some counter arguments in the fanposts and enjoy when y’all tear them to shreds.

by John Chambers on Jan 15, 2012 6:42 AM MST up reply actions  

My point is that I agree with the overall strategy of drafting high as the platform to build a nucleus.

This isn’t a strategy, it happened completely be accident. He spent to the cap and finished in 30th. There was never a strategy to do this.

Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.

by Derek Zona on Jan 15, 2012 7:42 AM MST up reply actions  

When we sat in 13th place in the conference and Hemsky and Khabbi went down with an injury in Nov & Dec ‘09, they elected to NOT trade for a G and instead call up Dubnyk. They gave Gagner, Nilsson, Cogliano, Brule, Potulny and O’Sullivan lots of ice and figured out who was worth keeping and who needed to be shown the door. Aside from Brule they were spot on.

The next season they again gave the new kids lots of ice, and IMO purposely fielded a weak defence. The ‘New Core’ is developing remarkably, while we drafted the franchise C we’ve so longed for. Penner, who doesn’t fit into the long term plans, was scuttled for a draft pick who may be here for a decade.

This season another shitanusly bad D was fielded and lots of time is being given to the Chosen line. Hemsky will likely also get dealt (although the optimal strategy is to sign him to a 2-year contract … more on that later) likely for a player with a high chance of complimenting the new core.

In the meanwhile our organizational depth has grown immensely, development has been the order of the day, and our bad contracts will soon expire.

Where you see dithering and ineptitude, Accenture sees strategy. You have to at least admit that by 2015 this organization will be in better shape than it’s been since 1988.

by John Chambers on Jan 15, 2012 9:38 AM MST up reply actions  

I tend to agree with John here. It’s true that there was no strategy to tank at the beginning of the 2009-10 season, by about the mid-point, it was pretty clear that there was and that the team has been focused on accumulating younger talent since that time. Now that reflects very badly on Steve Tambellini’s attempt to build a winner in the summer of 2009 (to the point that I’m surprised he kept his job), but it’s not like they’ve been wandering without a plan since then.

The biggest fanana of the Havana Bananas.

by Scott Reynolds on Jan 15, 2012 10:08 AM MST up reply actions  

If this was all part of the plan, could you explain the Vandermeer acquisition? Or not buying Khabibulin out? Or signing Eager to a three year deal?

Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.

by Derek Zona on Jan 15, 2012 11:55 AM MST up reply actions  

Vandermeer came at a marginal cost increase of just over $1M. What’s the problem there exactly?

Khabbi is currently our best goaltender. Buying him out this past summer say would cost us over $1M over the next 4 seasons for us to get nothing for him. We would also have to pay another goaltender … yes Vokoun became available by accident this past summer, but I don’t think there’s another G available at low-cost that delivers that much more. Buying out Khabbi’s contract right now would be terrible cap management.

I actually like your views on team toughness. I think it has a place, but playing bad hockey players who can take punches over good hockey players is a sound philosophy. Historically, Eager has been a not-as-poor-as-his-peers fighter inasmuch as he can throw hits, agitate, and pot the occasional goal. But again, at just over $1M a season, who cares?

Bad management is trading for Scott Gomez or dealing two first round picks for Phil Kessel while you’re rebuilding. Tambi hasn’t taken on an atrocious contract (Khabbi’s is bad, but not putrid), nor has he traded away the future.

Good management is building the core up to all hit their primes at the same time. You’re the only guy who’s not going to enjoy the BAM! Stanley Cup Parade in 2017.

by John Chambers on Jan 15, 2012 12:27 PM MST up reply actions  

Edit: Isn’t a sound philosophy. You get the drift.

by John Chambers on Jan 15, 2012 12:28 PM MST up reply actions  

When we sat in 13th place in the conference and Hemsky and Khabbi went down with an injury in Nov & Dec ‘09, they elected to NOT trade for a G and instead call up Dubnyk. They gave Gagner, Nilsson, Cogliano, Brule, Potulny and O’Sullivan lots of ice and figured out who was worth keeping and who needed to be shown the door. Aside from Brule they were spot on.

Again, this wasn’t on purpose. They did everything they possibly could to spend to the cap that season, including chasing Heatley.

This wasn’t part of some grand plan. Once they went into the tank they had little idea how to get out (see Lowe, Kevin circa 2006-2009) and finished last. Then they created this grand rebuild narrative, even though the rebuild started when Smyth was traded.

As for being in a better place in 2015, no I can’t admit that. Hall, Eberle, Paajarvi, Hopkins, Petry, Omark, Grigorenko, Lander will all be into their second contracts. Given the way Tambellini and Lowe have handled negotiations to this point, I have zero confidence in their ability to manage that contract cluster, plus build a defence and find goaltending.

They’ve already burned through their two best assets – Penner and Hemsky’s contracts. They’ve got one more year before they’re through the new best assets – the ELCs.

Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.

by Derek Zona on Jan 15, 2012 11:54 AM MST up reply actions  

The money isn’t as limiting a factor as you make it to be. They’ll be able to get everyone signed to new contracts without any difficulty.

by John Chambers on Jan 15, 2012 12:19 PM MST up reply actions  

I agree that they created the rebuild narrative after the fact, but it was with a healthy dollop of admitting failure too (the whole “clarity” business). In doing so the management group mostly acknowledged that they deserved an “F” for their post-Smyth performance (taken as a whole) and requested another chance. For whatever reason, this request was granted. A new plan (to really suck! for a while!) then began during the winter of 2010, and that’s when this rebuild “narrative” first comes up. You seem to think that it was to excuse past behavior, but that’s not what they did at all. They used this “narrative” to explain their plan for the future and excuse strategic failing for two to four seasons.

The biggest fanana of the Havana Bananas.

by Scott Reynolds on Jan 16, 2012 3:04 PM MST up reply actions  

Would you like me to list off top-five picks that worked out but didn’t lead the team into Cup contention in short order? Because it would be a long list, and that’s my point.

by Peter Raaymakers on Jan 14, 2012 2:21 PM MST up reply actions  

And the problem was that those top-3 picks weren’t succeeded by other top-3 picks. That’s my point.

by John Chambers on Jan 14, 2012 3:23 PM MST via mobile up reply actions  

The word “rebuild” denotes activity and progress. Drafting high is a league mandated policy based on poor performance and on it’s own isn’t a plan, it’s a result. Waiting for the draft would be better called “replenishing”.

I can’t support ST because I see no evidence of a strategy in progress. It isn’t that complicated. If you want to work through the draft, choose your core and keeper prospects. Liquidate everyone else for as many high picks or drafted prospects as you can get in a short time frame and get your elite talent, fill the team out with astute signings. Keep everyone in the AHL until ready.

I have no doubt a good GM could do this, and in three to four years you have a solid team. Taking the better part of a decade is ridiculous. Tallon only had two bad years after taking over the Hawks. During that time he busied himself acquiring at least 12 players. His two lottery picks, Keith, Seabrook and the others then won the Cup. Tallon had to sign forwards, The Oilers will have to sign defense.

The point is, just do something.

Renney is just following orders, although he may be the sacrifice to the fan base this summer.

Love Hurts - Performed by your Edmonton Oilers

by FastOil on Jan 14, 2012 3:55 PM MST reply actions  

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