Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Login-facebook
Around SBN: Blake Griffin Slam Dunks: NBA Jam Style

Sam Gagner - Just Give It Time

As a group, Oilers fans don't tend to agree on much. Generally, I think we all believe the rookies - Jordan Eberle, Taylor Hall, and Magnus Paajarvi - are pretty good and J.F Jacques is not. We might also agree that the sky is blue and that grass is green but beyond that though we don't agree on much at all. Sam Gagner is one player that the fans certainly do not agree on. There are those, including myself, who think Gagner is going to be a really good hockey player and that with his skill set he should be a key piece on this team for many seasons to come. Others would pick him up at his door ready to drive him to the airport if only he'd agreed to catch the very next plane out of town.

Star-divide

Gagner was taken by the Oilers sixth overall in the 2007 draft, our reward for surviving the Ryan Smyth death march. But, as his detractors will readily tell you, despite that lofty draft status and four years of NHL experience Gagner has yet to really establish himself as a first line centre capable of carrying the load in the NHL night after night.

In his rookie season Gagner scored 49 points but has been unable to match that total in the three season that followed. And points aren't the only measure when Gagner has failed to progress. He has been a minus player every year of his career and the -47 he's posted over his career is the worst cumulative total among all Oiler skaters over the past four seasons. Looking at the scoring chance information posted by Derek yesterday it's clear that Gagner struggled this season in general and struggled mightily when injuries decimated the Oiler lineup leaving him as the go to guy. This season he took 935 face-offs but won only 43.8% of them. In fact of the 65 players who took at least 900 face-offs in the NHL this season Gagner's winning percentage is better than only one player. You don't need me to tell you who that player is do you?

And then of course there is the fact that he's small. Those who don't like Gaganer will tell you that if this team is ever going to actually compete then they can only have so many small forwards, which might be true. With that in mind replacing Gagner now makes the most sense because size at the centre position is more important than size on the wing and Gagner will bring a decent return if we move him before he really stagnates and the rest of the NHL catches on to his shortcomings.

Those in the anti-Gagner camp make a compelling case. But I don't buy it.

Sure Gagner has played four season but look at the team he has played for. The Oilers have just 131 wins in 328 tries during Gagner's career. The teams points percentage over that span is 0.453, better than only the New York Islanders. To put it nicely, Gagner has played on some bad hockey teams in his short time in the NHL. The quality of the team around him has to be taken into account. As does the fact that Gagner has already played for three different head coaches - Craig MacTavish, Pat Quinn, and Tom Renney. Learning different systems and being assigned different responsibilities almost every September is not the type of consistency that is going to help a young player develop.  

And what about his age? Gagner will turn 22 on August 10. Think about that, he's played four years and 291 games in the NHL and hasn't turned 22 yet. He's played that much because he was rushed to the NHL, something that has impacted his development. At a minimum he should have spent his 18 year old season with the London Knights in the OHL but the Oilers instead chose to throw away any value they could have gotten from his entry level contract by playing him here as soon as they could. 

If Gagner is brought along slower he may have put up better numbers in his first couple season; he just as easily may not have. That's beside the point. If Gagner had been brought along slower and had just finished his third, or even better his second season, would you still want to trade him? I can't imagine many fans that would. He is still very young and it is widely accepted that young players improve as they get older, why would Gagner be any different? Why is he held to a different standard because the Oilers don't understand player development? I don't think it's much of a strecth to think that the flat line in Gagner's development has a lot to do with the fact that he was rushed into the NHL rather than just letting him get here on his own schedule.

It goes without saying that there are holes in Gagner's game. The face-offs still need work. After improving in each of his first three seasons, Gagner's winning percentage took a step back last season. It's doubtful that Gagner will turn into Manny Malhotra who wins more than 60% of the face-offs he takes but if he can consistently win just under half of his draws I don't think there would be a lot of complaints.

From what I see he needs to be better positionally in the Oilers end of the rink too but playing centre in the best league in the world isn't exactly the easiest of tasks to start with, it doesn't get easier when you're forced to learn on the fly after being dropped into the deep end as an 18 year old. Better defensive zone positioning will almost certainly result in that team worst -17 improving too. An on-ice save percentage better than 0.876 wouldn't hurt either.

I had hoped that this season would be the one where Gagner got back to the heights he reached as a rookie breaking the 50 point plateau for the first time in his career; that of course did not happen. But Gagner did match the point per game rate of his rookie season so I don't think the season was a failure either. In more ways than I would have liked Gagner didn't achieve what I had hoped for going into this season. Playing on a 30th place team likely didn't help much. Gagner is a talented hockey player, even those who would like to see him traded will agree with that assessment, we just have to give it time. We're giving Tambellini time why not Gagner too?

Prediction: If he can play 75 plus games I think Gagner will finally surpass his rookie season total getting to 55 points next season. With his contract expiring at the end of the season Gagner has the potential to get himself a nice payday with a strong performance next year. If things really click for him and he gets to 60 points it will be interesting to see what the Oilers do about a new contract this same time next year.

Comment 8 comments  |  0 recs  | 

Do you like this story?

Comments

Display:

An on-ice save percentage better than 0.876 wouldn’t hurt either.

That would go a long way towards making his numbers look respectable.

Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.

by Derek Zona on Jun 2, 2011 7:49 PM MDT reply actions  

Reminds me of Omark’s PDO Number a little bit.

Everyone knows rock attained perfection in 1974. It's a scientific fact.
Writer for The Copper & Blue and a frequenter of the time waster that is Twitter.

by ryanbatty on Jun 2, 2011 8:55 PM MDT up reply actions  

Guys would you rather have Gagne or Strome as your 2C?

by FastOil on Jun 3, 2011 12:54 PM MDT reply actions  

Strome. he’ll be here when this team starts to win

by gcw_rocks on Jun 3, 2011 1:29 PM MDT up reply actions  

As a loyal to staff employer, I can tell you there is a lot of waste and pain and damage in hitching you’re wagon to the wrong horse.

To me the top draftees in any year will be good NHL’ers. Barring injury, if it doesn’t happen they weren’t evaluated properly or were ruined by the team.

It only makes sense to find players with the highest ceilings, and to continually upgrade positions. Even the Canucks have figured that out and look where it got them (GO BRUINS). The core becomes set only when players show they have what you want – gaining experience is a different matter, one of time.

The players for the most part that have the most potential will have the fewest drawbacks and no major ones. If there are 2-3 guys in the draft with more upside than what we have, I would strive to make a deal to improve my team by getting as many as possible. Of course I would also look to trades and signings, whatever I could pull off, after doing due dilligence, if I saw someone I liked.

Losing modest experience on a team that won’t be in a position to win much for a few years is worth gaining potential and increased chances of future success, and will be a wash down the road anyway.

For me, if anyone with a top 5 picks liked Gagne a lot, I would press to upgrade my 2C with Couturier or Strome.

by FastOil on Jun 3, 2011 1:48 PM MDT reply actions  

Losing modest experience on a team that won’t be in a position to win much for a few years is worth gaining potential and increased chances of future success, and will be a wash down the road anyway.

I could get behind this if not for the fact that the team loses players with experience at an alarming rate. I’m not totally opposed to trading Gagner depending on the return, but with Hemsky supposedly on the trading block, too, this team will very soon only have 3 or 4 “veterans”, and one of them will be Cogliano (assuming he’s not traded, too.) If the Oilers keep expecting these kids to learn to swim by being thrown in the deep end, a lot of them are going to drown. Not exactly a good way to develop talent.

by despisethesun on Jun 3, 2011 2:10 PM MDT reply actions  

You can only trade these guys if you plan to be very active with bringing in veterans through FA. There is a long list of vets that can be brough in to tutor the kids, some of which would could come from this list (not thoroughly vetted, so if there are duds on this list, oh well):

Langenbrunner, Jamie "
Clark, Chris "
Fleischmann, Tomas "
Kobasew, Chuck "
Sopel, Brent "
Miettinen, Antti "
Upshall, Scottie "
Laich, Brooks "
Hejda, Jan "
Larose, Chad "
Jokinen, Jussi "
O’Brien, Shane "
Higgins, Chris "
Montador, Steve "
Martinek, Radek "
Ward, Joel "
Babchuk, Anton "
Dupuis, Pascal "
Ruutu, Jarkko "
Prucha, Petr "
Reasoner, Marty "
Eminger, Steve "
Blindenbacher, Severin "
Fiddler, Vernon "
Alberts, Andrew "
Talbot, Maxime "
Fedotenko, Ruslan "
Jones, Randy "
Bradley, Matt "
Lukowich, Brad "
Eager, Ben "
Ericsson, Jonathan "
Rupp, Michael "
Sutherby, Brian "
Leino, Ville "
Gordon, Boyd "
Belanger, Eric "
Asham, Arron "

by gcw_rocks on Jun 3, 2011 3:47 PM MDT up reply actions  

Agreed. The problem is that for a young team the veteran leadership is typically deployed in the bottom 6 – the young talent therefore protected and allowed do what they know – try to score and gain experience.

It takes time for players to become effective role players. Trying to draft your bottom 6 I think is foolish. Offensive players are the ones who can excel early typically, and are the rare and hard to acquire players.

I worry that hanging on to players because they are the most experienced on the team when there are better players to be had will make becoming a contender difficult. The top 6 is all about talent and production, so you need the most talented to become and remain at the top of the game.

The Oilers have acquired close to as much top talent as they can retain anyway. Then there needs to be a tactical change to complete the roster properly. Get your high end guys, then get the role players, the bottom 6 and bottom pairing by signing or trade – goalie too if you need one.

This is how every team has turned around. The teams that got to the top have also acquired dominant players – as disgusting as it is, look at the difference in the Canuckleheads after dropping the “pylons for D” strategy and getting some puck movers, and up front getting Malhotra and a good 4th line. If Malhotra had played up to now I think we would have seen them really cruise through. Puke.

The Canucklebiters aren’t weak at many positions, it shows, and we can’t be either.

It is also not fair to the really good players you do have saddling them with players that can’t keep up or pull their weight, or get their jobs done well enough. It causes frustration . It is critical that the Oilers rebuild a strong sense of team, loyalty to each other and the belief they are the best team and can win any game or series, or we will spend another 20 years watching “almost got there” and see the suitcases of the best players on their way to greener pastures.

by FastOil on Jun 3, 2011 4:00 PM MDT up reply actions  

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

Welcome to SB Nation's Edmonton Oilers community.

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recent FanPosts

Ryan_2008_small
The Oilers Begin the Road to Rebuilding
Small
Oilers Next Head Coach
Small
Josh Anderson Scouting Report
Small
The 2012 NHL Draft and Combine - the Fanpost Almanac
Chambers-john_small
Risk Reward Radulov
Small
Joonas Korpisalo Scouting Report
2012-01-21-012338_small
Oilers Prospect Frans Tuohimaa Signs an Extension with Jokerit
Small
Ryan Murray - The Numbers
Chambers-john_small
Cody Hodgson, the game within the game, and inattention to detail
Small
Hong Kong Animators Draw NHL Violence

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >

32 - 40 - 10

Lost 3

Clear Victory Standings

Western Conference

  1. Detroit Red Wings (27-11, .711)
  2. St. Louis Blues (24-10, .706)
  3. Vancouver Canucks (22-10, .688)
  4. Los Angeles Kings (18-11, .621)
  5. San Jose Sharks (18-13, .581)
  6. Phoenix Coyotes (20-15, .571)
  7. Nashville Predators (18-14, .563)
  8. Chicago Blackhawks (21-19, .525)
  9. Colorado Avalanche (16-19, .457)
  10. Dallas Stars (18-22, .450)
  11. Anaheim Ducks (14-19, .424)
  12. Edmonton Oilers (18-25, .419)
  13. Calgary Flames (13-21, .382)
  14. Columbus Blue Jackets (14-31, .311)
  15. Minnesota Wild (8-22,.267)

Eastern Conference

  1. Pittsburgh Penguins (31-13, .711)
  2. Boston Bruins (27-11, .711)
  3. New York Rangers (25-16, .610)
  4. Philadelphia Flyers (21-17, .553)
  5. New Jersey Devils (18-16, .529)
  6. Ottawa Senators (19-17, .528)
  7. Washington Capitals (20-19, .513)
  8. Montreal Canadiens (16-19, .457)
  9. Winnipeg Jets (15-19, .441)
  10. Buffalo Sabres (14-18, .438)
  11. Carolina Hurricanes (13-17, .433)
  12. Florida Panthers (14-19, .424)
  13. Toronto Maple Leafs (17-24, .415)
  14. New York Islanders (8-23, .258)
  15. Tampa Bay Lightning (10-30, .250)

Division Standings

  1. Central (79-58, .577)
  2. Atlantic (68-50, .576)
  3. Pacific (62-54, .534)
  4. Northeast (69-65, .515)
  5. Northwest (49-69, .415)
  6. Southeast (51-81, .386)


Managing Editor

Kurri_small Derek Zona

Laraque_horcoff_250x360_small Scott Reynolds

Columnists

Batman_small ryanbatty

0615pisani_small dawgbone98

Neal_small Neal Livingston

Mike_small Mike Wntrz

Small Alan Hull

Contributors

Newtwitter2_small Jonathan Willis

Mccurdycloseup_small Bruce McCurdy

Esaandstanley_small Benjamin Massey

Me_smyth_bobblehead3__1_of_1__small Lisa McRitchie

Small Triumph44

Gyi0062208469-bobrovsky_small Chase W

Small JaredL