Mayor Mandel Takes Manhattan
News surrounding the Oilers proposed arena development has been coming fast and furious over the last couple of weeks. First, the Katz Group issued an ultimatum of sorts for a deal to be reached by the end of October, which also included a disclaimer on the $100M for surrounding development and included the purchase price of the Oilers as part of Katz's commitment to Edmonton This was followed by a bizarre email from Patrick Laforge to key supporters that wasn't exactly a "call to arms" but did encourage supporters to contact the City to voice their opinions. And finally word came late last week that Mayor Mandel would be travelling to New York City to meet with Gary Bettman who would help facilitate an agreement between the City and Katz Group.
For a number of reasons, I haven't supported the Oilers and the Katz Group in their quest to secure public funding for a new arena. In fact, I've found the manner in which the Katz Group has gone about the negotiation process comical as they have a City Council that I believe wants to help them and yet they can't seem to keep themselves from shooting off a toe or two every couple of weeks with a not-so-veiled threat to relocate the team or, as was the case recently, a strange and inaccurate email from the hockey team's CEO. But as bizarre as the process has been, that Gary Bettman is involved, well that just ups the bizarre factor to a whole new level.
To put it simply, having the Mayor fly across the continent to meet with Bettman borders on the ridiculous. He isn't now, nor will he ever be, a partner in any new arena in Edmonton. He doesn't, as far as I know, have $100M to cover the funding gap. He doesn't have any suggestions on a non-compete agreement with Northlands. Why, then, should he ever be in a room with the parties that need to get these things figured out? If his role is simply to help facilitate talks I would think that there would have been someone available in the Edmonton area who probably could have done the job of facilitator and wasn't also employed by Katz.
Remember, Bettman is employed by Katz and the other 29 NHL owners; he works for them, not the other way around. In theory his involvement may not seem like a terrible idea but with his employer being one of the parties in the room, he isn't impartial, and thus any value he has as a facilitator goes right out the window. Put yourself in a similar position: would you really be of any use to the process? Would you say anything that wasn't completely in line with your bosses wants or desires? Of course you wouldn't and neither will Bettman. He's not impartial in this process and therefore his role as a facilitator makes no sense.
But as if having Bettman in the room wasn't weird enough, word came out yesterday afternoon that Bill Daly will be joining the conversation today. NHL Deputy Commissioner Bill Daly. The man who works for Bettman, who works for Katz. Considering that Bettman shouldn't be part of this process, then what exactly does having Daly in the room provide? If he isn't in charge of making sure everyone's water glass is full then I really don't know what he's doing there.
To up the whole process to absurd, Bettman has asked for a media blackout until the meetings are complete. That's a nice request but Mayor Mandel doesn't work for Bettman, he works for the citizens of Edmonton, the good folks being asked to hand over hundreds of millions of dollars to a billionaire. Considering the interest in the arena issue in Edmonton the Mayor should have issued a statement. He didn't have to provide a blow-by-blow recap of the meeting, just a short simple statement along the lines of "There was good dialogue today. I'll be bringing the rest of Council up to speed tonight, and we'll see how tomorrow goes." The statement itself doesn't really say anything but it avoids the impression that the Mayor is taking his cues from Bettman.
Again I'm not against having a facilitator get involved, especially with Katz's land options set to expire and Council seeing this as a priority, but that facilitator shouldn't be an employee of either party. If at the end of today there is an agreement in place on either of the outstanding items - the additional $100M or the ridiculous need for a non-compete agreement with Northlands - that sees the City investing additional money into this project it will have the distinct look of 30 NHL owners sitting down and bullying the City of Edmonton into a deal. I know some fans will be fine with a deal in any form, but that will leave a very bad taste in my mouth.
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but that will leave a very bad taste in my mouth
I love that this is “will” and not “would”.
The biggest fanana of the Havana Bananas.
by Scott Reynolds on Oct 12, 2011 12:16 PM MDT reply actions
Gives you a pretty good idea of where my head is at with the arena process.
Everyone knows rock attained perfection in 1974. It's a scientific fact.
Writer for The Copper & Blue and a frequenter of the time waster that is Twitter.
Is it the arena itself that you have a problem with or the process in making it happen?
How much would it cost to renovate northlands? and has the Alberta government said anything else about funding this project (the new arena)?
It’s the process. I don’t love the idea of subsidizing sports teams, especially not ones that are in the top quarter of league revenue generators, but the process has been a joke. Early steps in the process were either skipped entirely or glossed over.
- Team isn’t viable in Rexall, prove it
- What if Katz got 100% of revenue in Rexall, never asked
- $250M to update Rexall to “modern standards”, is this a must
Those questions were never addressed, instead it was just decided that a new arena was needed and that it would benefit all of downtown just by existing which I doubt. Part of the funding will come from a CRL which simply reallocates taxes from other areas of the City, meaning taxes will go up. Other funding will come from a ticket tax, which some want to attribute to Katz which makes no sense.
I could get on board with some amount of City funding but as is, no I’m not good with that.
Everyone knows rock attained perfection in 1974. It's a scientific fact.
Writer for The Copper & Blue and a frequenter of the time waster that is Twitter.
I don’t know enough about how Northlands runs everything, Katz doesn’t receive anything except ticket sales though right? So I understand where he is coming from if I invested in a team I would want to see some money coming my way.
I think the Rush owner has it worse than anyone, Northlands makes him bring in his own scoreclock.
I don’t Katz is alone on that front, I think we’d all like to have more money coming in.
But remember he bought the team knowing where the money went. To cry poor (not a chance in hell) a couple years later and demand hundreds of millions in taxpayer dollars just doesn’t seem right to me.
Everyone knows rock attained perfection in 1974. It's a scientific fact.
Writer for The Copper & Blue and a frequenter of the time waster that is Twitter.
Also, if he wants more money then the proper thing to do is raise ticket sales and let the fans decide. Holding the city hostage is not a suitable first step if profits are your motive.
by till_horcoff_is_coach on Oct 13, 2011 8:36 AM MDT up reply actions
all good points but...
“Those questions were never adressed”
Did you read all the minutes from every meeting since Katz took possession of the team?
by One_Roy_Save_On_The_Calendar on Oct 13, 2011 1:01 AM MDT up reply actions
I’ve kept myself very informed on the subject and I’ve never seen anything on those questions. Considering their importance I thInk if they had been addresses we would know about it.
Have you seen anything that makes you think these have been addressed?
Everyone knows rock attained perfection in 1974. It's a scientific fact.
Writer for The Copper & Blue and a frequenter of the time waster that is Twitter.
by ryanbatty on Oct 13, 2011 1:52 PM MDT via mobile up reply actions
We all have our own opinion, but when were we ever asked to pay hunreds of millions to expand the LRT? We never were consulted once, and now the streets and road construction have suffered. In fact, we wouldnt even spray the mosquitos for most of the year as it was too much money coming out of the LRT bank. With a new arena, depending where it is located, we should all assume the friggen LRT will have to be expanded there also.
Id rather see our taxpayers money go to an arena, which i will at least go to and see, visit, spend money at, and generate income for the city, rather than an already nusance of an LRT system that is a sunk cost, loses millions daily, and takes real funding out of more important areas.
Mandell is going to do what he wants, not what we want. He cares more about a lasting legacy (whether good or bad) then anything else.
Taxes WILL increase, regardless. Might as well go towards an arena that will bring in more athletes, will create more excitement, will entertain better musicians, and maybe one day, house another sports team (?)
by H.O.P.E (Hall.Omark.Paajarvi.Eberle) on Oct 12, 2011 2:32 PM MDT reply actions
but when were we ever asked to pay hunreds of millions to expand the LRT?
While I get what you’re saying (I hope at least) I don’t think it necessarily applies. The efficient movement of people and good is something a city needs to ensure, LRT does that. As the City continues to expand outward building bigger wider roads to move people becomes cost prohibitive and mass transit is the best solution. In this case the LRT, or some other form of mass transit, is the only option. I don’t think you can say the same thing with a new arena, that we absolutely must have it.
Everyone knows rock attained perfection in 1974. It's a scientific fact.
Writer for The Copper & Blue and a frequenter of the time waster that is Twitter.
you are right, they are seperate issues; however, what im getting at is that the arena itself is not a big deal to fund. Bang for buck it will make a much larger impact on the city than the LRT, and cost far far less. It will be a hot spot for the city, somewhere to attract new talant, new concerts, and maybe one day a new franchise (Lingere Football anyone!), so what im saying is that we shouldnt get too worked up about tax money going into Katz pocket, cause guess what, it already does! he gets massive tax breaks and owns a lot of the city. Nobody seems to mention that. I understand that the rich keep getting richer and the same principle is here; however, none of us can buy the OIlers and keep them here in Rexall, so the owner should be able to have some say in what happens. Other arena contracts are built similarily so i can understand why he wants the same proposal. Why not make some sort of agreement then that we will pay the extra money ($100M), but some sort of revenue will be shared until the principle is paid back? Like 2% after costs… even if its interest free.
The LRT may not have been a very good example, but in a city full of blue collar workers, most need their vehicles anyways for work. Students use the LRT, but students wont be paying for the arena – workers will. The same workers that funded an expansion on the LRT without complaint. The same workers that work hard to play hard and want to see the Oilers in a state of the art arena and maybe for once be the envy of the league.
We are a very proud city, lets show it off and attract new players here. Then, people may stop with the " but it has such cold weather" redundant remarks.
by H.O.P.E (Hall.Omark.Paajarvi.Eberle) on Oct 12, 2011 3:07 PM MDT up reply actions
I don’t think a new arena is going to make anyone around the league envious, just as I’m pretty sure the deciding factor for players to sign with the Oilers is not the state of the building they play in. If you want to be the envy of the league and you want players lining up to sign contracts, try putting a winning product on the ice. Compete for the Cup every year and you’ll be the envy of the league – players and fans alike. A building has nothing to do with that.
The Penguins announcers were gushing about Rexall Place being such a great building.
Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.
It’s a great building. Drop $30M on required structural repairs and forget all about a modern facility. Problem solved.
Everyone knows rock attained perfection in 1974. It's a scientific fact.
Writer for The Copper & Blue and a frequenter of the time waster that is Twitter.
So you’re saying winning is important? I thought the key was high draft picks and a brand new building, at least hat’s what this team seems to think.
Everyone knows rock attained perfection in 1974. It's a scientific fact.
Writer for The Copper & Blue and a frequenter of the time waster that is Twitter.
True, players wont sign here merely cause of the new arena; however, we may end up attracting new concerts, new sports leagues, and have more to do. The city itself will be more attractive to everyone, us included.
Plus, the estimate was $200M for repairs. At what point do we consider it a sunk cost and build a new arena?
The only problem i have is how they are treating Northlands!
by H.O.P.E (Hall.Omark.Paajarvi.Eberle) on Oct 12, 2011 3:59 PM MDT reply actions
Plus, the estimate was $200M for repairs.
No it’s $200-$250M to bring the building up to current standards. The required repairs are only $30M.
Everyone knows rock attained perfection in 1974. It's a scientific fact.
Writer for The Copper & Blue and a frequenter of the time waster that is Twitter.

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