Your Favorite Post-Dynasty Oiler
by Derek Zona on Sep 6, 2010 11:30 AM MDT
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We've looked at seven post-dynasty Oilers -- Mike Grier, Todd Marchant, Janne Niinimaa, Dustin Penner, Jason Smith, Ryan Smyth, and Doug Weight -- and each of the authors here has found at least some commenter support for each selection.
So we want to hear from you. Who did we miss? Who is your favorite post-dynasty Oiler and why? Pick any player that didn't win a cup in Edmonton and tell us your story about him below. If it's in-depth, or you've got a special story to tell, use the FanPost feature and we'll try and get you some front page space.
Aside from Radek Dvorak, the one player missing from the list thus far is Ales Hemsky. But the beauty of playing in a joint like this is the ability to write whatever, whenever. I'm sure we'll find some time to talk about Hemsky this year.
It struck me that every player on the list besides Penner was unceremoniously dumped from Edmonton. After the jump, I'll look at the return from each player and the provenance of that return.
- Mike Grier - Grier was traded to the Capitals in 2002 for a 2nd round pick and a 3rd round pick in 2003. The 2nd round pick was later sent to the Islanders with Janne Niinimaa for Raffi Torres and Brad Isbister. The Oilers used the 3rd round pick on Zack Stortini.
- Todd Marchant - Left as an unrestricted free agent.
- Janne Niinimaa - Traded to the Islanders with the 2nd round pick from the Grier deal for Raffi Torres and Brad Isbister. Raffi Torres was traded to Columbus for Gilbert Brule. Isbister was traded to Boston for a 4th round pick in 2006. The 4th round pick was traded back to the Bruins for Yan Stastny. Stastny was traded, along with Marty Reasoner and a 2nd round pick back to Boston for Sergei Samsonov. Samsonov left as a free agent after the Oilers made the Stanley Cup Finals.
- Jason Smith - Traded, along with Joffrey Lupul to the Flyers in exchange for Geoff Sanderson, Joni Pitkanen and a 3rd round pick. The Oilers traded Joni Pitkanen to the Hurricanes for Erik Cole, then traded Cole back to the Hurricanes along with a 5th round pick for Patrick O'Sullivan and a 2nd round pick. The Oilers traded the 2nd round pick for Ales Kotalik, who left at season's end as a free agent. Patrick O'Sullivan was traded to the Coyotes for Jim Vandermeer. The 3rd round selection was used on Cameron Abney.
- Ryan Smyth - Traded to the Islanders for Robert Nilsson, Ryan O'Marra, and a 1st round pick. Robert Nilsson was bought out. The Oilers used the 1st round pick on Alex Plante.
- Doug Weight - Traded to the Blues with Michael Riesen for Jochen Hecht, Jan Horacek and Marty Reasoner. Jochen Hecht traded to the Sabres for two 2nd round picks. The Oilers selected Jeff Deslauriers and Jarret Stoll with the picks. Reasoner was traded, along with Yan Stastny and a 2nd round pick to Boston for Sergei Samsonov. Jarret Stoll was traded, along with Matt Greene, to Los Angeles for Lubomir Visnovsky. Visnovsky was traded to Anaheim for Ryan Whitney and a 6th round pick. The Oilers used that selection on Brandon Davidson.
There you have it. In some weird, twisted way, the Oilers managed to turn our six favorite post-dynasty players into Gilbert Brule, Zack Stortini, a playoff run from Sergei Samsonov, a regular season run from Ales Kotalik, Jim Vandermeer, Cameron Abney, Ryan O'Marra, Alex Plante, Ryan Whitney and Brandon Davidson.
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In the Gator summary, you neglected Sanderson’s ultimate fate: retirement after the season. Not entirely relevant to the final analysis, but worth noting.
I know I bugged some people on Twitter for mentioning Hemsky as a runner-up so many times, but it’s hard not to take “San Fernando” Pisani, either. Another one of those hard-working, gritty guys that exemplified the Little Team That Could — who, coincidentally, was the heir to Mike Grier’s spot at 3RW — but also a hometown kid who made good, first by coming up from the billionth 8th round to make the NHL, then by going on a Drucian run in the ‘06 playoffs to make that run possible: had the Oilers won Game 7, it would be a tough choice between him, Roli, and Pronger for sure. As a sentimental favourite, it’s also hard to see the way his career’s turned in the years since then, as illness/injury and the time it’s cost him, combined with his age (he’s a ’96 draft!) are starting to take a toll on his game. Hopefully he finds new life in the Windy City.
SNN Sports - A theoretical Oilers blog (i.e. theoretically, I write stuff there). Link now 100% less broken.
It might look bad right now, but to be honest, I think Ryan Whitney has the makings to be one of those players that becomes a lot of fans favorite Oiler.
Gibert Brule also, IMHO might be one of those players that still has a lot more upside than he has revealed so far, and if he starts hitting some of his offensive potential, coupled with his gritty/feisty play could also easily become one of those much loved players.
Stortini is just starting to come into his own and is on a track to be very Kelly Buchberger-esque.
Add in that Alex Plante still could develop into a very solid NHL’er and has potential to contribute for another decade if he meets his developmental upside.
To a lesser degree O’Marra has that too…he’s got a great shot, and is amazing on the dot, has some size and can skate pretty decently, and I also think he gets overlooked far too often as a potential future contributor.
I don’t have a whole lot of hope for Abney, but he’s still pretty young and you just never know.
I guess my point is, it’s just way to soon to judge what kind of legacy those current players will leave.
Among the players mentions my favorite is Penner. Otherwise, Its Pitkanen for me. I just loved his skating. He was just so fluid and could skate circles around half the players on the ice!
Sins can be forgiven but conscience is a killer.
Unfortunately for Joni, he came to a very bad team and a coach that had no patience for working with players at the time.
Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.
I liked Pitkanen a lot as a player (defensemen in general don’t take enough breakaways), but it’s hard to choose him as my favourite given that he was only here for a year and obviously hated it. I though all of the players listed were worthy selections, even if Weight was kind of a boring pick (he was too straight-up talented to ever represent what we loved about the post-dynasty Oilers, which had very little to do with straight-up talent); while my favourite was Marchant, one guy I’d like to see get a little more love is Bobo Mironov. Also, I’m not sure if he makes the post-dynasty cut given when his career started, but Kelly Buchberger in 1997 was Fernando Pisani 2006 in miniature. Fortunately, it wasn’t a contract year.
This has been a really enjoyable series.
by sarcasticidealist on Sep 6, 2010 12:30 PM MDT reply actions
Weight had talent AND passion, so certainly warrants consideration IMO. Agree with you that Bobo deserves some love, he was a real horse for a few years there, and a “character” player in more ways than one!
I personally consider Bucky a “dynasty Oiler” (two rings), although his career stretched right through the lean years and on into the Little Team era. But I personally only considered anyone who arrived after 1990.
Writer for The Copper & Blue and primary shareholder of Zorg Industries
"Never be ashamed of who you are" -- Jean-Baptiste Emanuel Zorg
by Bruce McCurdy on Sep 6, 2010 12:38 PM MDT up reply actions
Oh, Weight obviously merits considerations; he was a huge part of the teams of that era, and if I was putting together a hockey team circa 1997 he’s the first member of the Oilers I’d put on it. But the little team that could is the one I fell in love with, and to me it’s personified not by the genuine all-star who just never had the supporting cast to take his team to the Cup, but by the speedy checking forward with the hands of stone who happened to score some of the biggest goals in franchise history, by the spazzy number one defenseman who was Acid before we’d ever heard of Grebs, and by the guy who’d hit everything that moved all while scoring 20 goals and becoming a penalty killing specialist. Guys who always seemed to be called upon to play a role beyond their natural talent, but who still managed to shine from time to time while doing it. That was the Oilers from 1997-2002.
Put another way, there’s no doubt that Smyth-Weight-Guerin was that team’s best line, but MGM’s the one I’ll always remember.
by sarcasticidealist on Sep 6, 2010 12:57 PM MDT up reply actions
To be fair to Kevin Lowe and the Oilers, Todd Marchant wasn’t exactly unceremoniously booted out of town. He had a career year in his contract season, Lowe figured that Marchant wouldn’t be worth the money Columbus offered him, and Lowe was proven right.
by Benjamin Massey on Sep 6, 2010 12:45 PM MDT reply actions
My oft-faulty memory recalls him talking in the papers about how much he wanted to remain in edmonton but they didn’t even bother to send him an offer nor even contact him or his agent. I would call that the boot… professionalism would at the least include expressing their future plans with him and how he does or doesn’t fit, not avoiding contact like the waitress that forgot your order.
by till_horcoff_is_coach on Sep 6, 2010 1:31 PM MDT up reply actions
To be fair to the team it was obvious after the season he had that he was going to want big, big $.
To be fair to the team he had asked to be given a larger role in the offense and they gave it to him.
To be unfair to the team – why on this green earth did they do that? That was just stupid in all sorts of ways.
Finally, I have often wondered – was the easy split with Marchant the first step in changing the leadership of the team… or did he see himself as a leader and they did not?
Still. Giving a 3rd line guy offense orientated minutes is just silly. See also: Stoll, Jarret.
by Jaysen Knight on Sep 6, 2010 1:38 PM MDT up reply actions
Thiough, to answer my own question, a pump and dump makes sense.
by Jaysen Knight on Sep 6, 2010 1:38 PM MDT up reply actions
I don’t think he asked for a larger role, I think the Oilers just had no depth at C.
Mike Comrie and Mike York got hurt that year, and Smyth missed a bunch of games as well. Marchant stepped up and had a career year.
In theory, there is little difference between practice and theory, but in practice there is!
hrmmmm…
77gp Marchant
71gp York
70gp Reasoner
69gp Comrie
66gp Smyth
I can’t really go along with that reasoning. Admittedly (see below) my memory is fuzzy but Marchant wanted the role and had for a while (once Weight was gone).
by Jaysen Knight on Sep 6, 2010 4:56 PM MDT up reply actions
York was almost entirely a left winger when he was an Oiler if memory serves me right. Marty Sakic wasn’t yet in his 55-minutes-a-night MacTavish-loving Marty Sakic prime.
by Benjamin Massey on Sep 6, 2010 6:18 PM MDT up reply actions
York did play a lot of wing in Edmonton but, for that year, I don’t know how much L he played – we had 5 naturals play solid minutes (Smyth, Moreau, Cleary, Chimera, Laraque) so he may have spent time there… but as a fixture? Not so sure.
Full disclosure mentions:
a) Per db’s post below, Marchant wasn’t QO’d and he left for Columbus in the off-season. He had wanted 2+ million. Per – some rather long threads where db and I got into it pretty heavy at times – db figured Lowe signed him low as he was looking at having too many small centers and Marchant wanted too much anyways / my figuring was that he was worth more as an asset and should have been QO’d first and traded later. At the end of it all it was an agree to disagree situation.
b) From where I sit Marchant got a lot of pp time he didn’t need to get and, though I can’t prove it, I think he got a big shift in zone starts (big jump in points and +/-). THAT SAID – does it matter? He was UFA at the end of the year anyways. Which kind of invalidates an earlier comment I made.
More research than I wanted to do just for the sake of comment section narrative but I guess it is better to be somewhat learned and sometimes mistaken than to be wrong and ignorant.
Kind of bugs me though – I was neck deep in this very discussion just 6-7 years ago! I’m not getting that old that fast am I… don’t answer that. Just don’t.
by Jaysen Knight on Sep 7, 2010 1:52 AM MDT up reply actions
this sounds exactly like the Horcoff contract situation
Sins can be forgiven but conscience is a killer.
Todd Marchant never had a point a game season (even an abbreviated one).
by sarcasticidealist on Sep 6, 2010 2:46 PM MDT up reply actions
I think he’s referring to the idea more than the particulars. The Oilers signed Horc to his new deal after feeding him the easiest minutes he’s seen in the last five seasons.
by Scott Reynolds on Sep 6, 2010 3:06 PM MDT up reply actions
I think that was the season before.
The Oilers only gave him his Q.O. (of about $1.8mil IIRC), and he took it. That Q.O. made him a UFA because he played 10 years in the NHL and made less than the league average in salary (I forget what classification it is now, but Paul Kariya did the same thing to join the Avs).
In theory, there is little difference between practice and theory, but in practice there is!
Totally correct (said to acknowledge, not validate – don’t need me to validate you being right); I remember some ranting going on about this back in the day, heck – I remember doing some of that ranting but, for the life of me, I forget the rational.
I do remember NOT liking the QO approach as it meant losing an asset for nothing – I think he was willing to hold out or something…. hrmmmm
by Jaysen Knight on Sep 6, 2010 4:35 PM MDT up reply actions
Kirk Maltby was always a guy I had a soft spot for. Hit everything that moved and did a great job of what he was asked for. I was dismayed when he was traded. I know he wasn’t around long, but for the time he was, I knew he was a gooder.
Good call, BQ. From an Oilers perspective, Maltby begat McGillis begat Niinimaa begat Torres begat Brule which isn’t a bad succession, but from a Red Wings perspective Maltby begat four Stanleys.
KM was/is an obnoxious little prick of the exact type Oilers have been crying for since approximately the day he left.
Writer for The Copper & Blue and primary shareholder of Zorg Industries
"Never be ashamed of who you are" -- Jean-Baptiste Emanuel Zorg
by Bruce McCurdy on Sep 6, 2010 10:37 PM MDT up reply actions
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