Dropping Anchor
I posed this in the comments section at Lowetide's joint the other day:
Today's fun maths:
League-wide, there are 135 forwards on playoff contending teams that are playing 12 mins+ of ES a night.
Ethan Moreau is 132nd in Corsi.
Ethan Moreau is second in penalties taken.
Ethan Moreau is 134th is taken/drawn differential.
Ethan Moreau is 113th in GF/60.
Ethan Moreau is 111th in Pts/60.
Ethan Moreau is 20th [last] on the Edmonton Oilers among all players, not just forwards, in scoring chance differential.
Conclusion: Ethan Moreau is the worst forward on any of the 21 teams in the playoff race.
The above obviously raises some interesting questions about Moreau's effect on his teammates, specifically some younger players that he's been teamed with. According to Stats.HockeyAnalysis.com Moreau's most common linemates are Cogliano and Pouliot . A quick check shows that Andrew Cogliano's most common linemate is Moreau. Nilsson and Gagner are close behind, then then Marc Pouliot is close to that pair. The same check on Pouliot shows that his most common linemates are Moreau and Cogliano.
Neither Cogliano nor Pouliot make the list of 135 because they aren't averaging 12 mins of ES time a night, but it's useful to see their numbers in the same context if either were playing 12 mins a night:
Corsi: Cogliano 104; Pouliot 112
Penalties Taken: Cogliano 104; Pouliot 72
Taken/Drawn differential: Cogliano 27; Pouliot 94
GF/60: Cogliano 116; Pouliot 108
Pts/60: Cogliano 99; Pouliot 99
CHDIFF: Cogliano 7; Pouliot 9
Moreau's GF/60 is barely statistically different than Cogliano and is very easily accounted for by the time that he spent with Horcoff, where they average 1.775 GF/20 together. [Check this on the HockeyAnalysis page under ES Goals For with Teammates - with Horcoff, Moreau has 7 GF in 79 minutes of time.] So since Ethan Moreau is so bad, he's clearly bringing Cogliano and Pouliot down, right? Maybe not. Back to Stats.HockeyAnalysis.com, let's check the kids with and without Moreau:
Pouliot's falloff without Moreau is perhaps explained by being teamed with Kyle Brodziak and Jason Strudwick most often away from Moreau and Cogliano. Cogliano, on the other hand is a different story. He's worse away from Moreau, and his linemates away from Moreau and Pouliot are Sam Gagner and Robert Nilsson. Is it Cogliano that is slumming with Moreau, instead of being held back by Moreau? He's not playing with the end of the roster, so let's look elsewhere. Vic's timeonice charts should allow us to determine just what's going on with Cogliano.
The first line chart [player 99 is the line combination] looks at Moreau, Cogliano, Pouliot together, they've played 25 games together. The combined line stats are much stronger than Cogliano's individual numbers, it's barely outscoring, but it is. It's getting outshot a bit, but I don't think this line is holding Cogliano back. Maybe it's just Moreau and the numbers at Stats.HockeyAnalysis.com are flukey. The second chart shows Moreau and Cogliano with random linemate. Huh. In 50 games together, the numbers aren't all that awful - certainly the EVsave% is worth a mention as .943 when they are on the ice won't be sustainable and should cause howls when it regresses, but again, doesn't seem that Moreau is the anchor here, either. Again, breaking even in the scoring department and getting outshot. It helps when your goalie is throwing up .943 behind you.
Now, last year and this year's early season, much-vaunted kid line in 32 games. Outscored by two goals, and outshot, nothing completely egregious here. These are the talent, playing softies and they aren't scoring all that much, in fact, Cogliano scores less when he's playing with the talent against buttery soft minutes. Why?
What is my conclusion? I have no idea -- maybe commentors will help a bit. My original premise when I started this was "Moreau stinks, let's see how bad the stench is". And possibly discuss how he's retarding both Cogliano and Pouliot's development. I still believe that he stinks, now I believe that Cogliano is not doing his part in his own development. Remember, he's playing against extremely soft competition - MacTavish is killing Shawn Horcoff and making Brodziak climb mountains in order to shield Cogliano and Gagner.
Part of the problem with measuring Cogliano's production and looking at his numbers is that the guy never starts with the puck. His faceoff percentage is 37.8% for the season and In the last eleven games, he's 33W 88L for 27%. In the last five games, he's 19% - 8W 35L. He's getting worse as the season goes on! I think that the next Oilers coach should give very serious consideration to making Cogliano a right wing. His scoring chance numbers, tracked by Dennis and compiled by Scott at the Gospel Of Hockey far outpace Moreau and one would think they would only increase if he ever had the puck.
In conclusion, Ethan Moreau stinks. Andrew Cogliano is not doing as well as he should.
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I agree on the conclusion, and it leads to another point: why isn't Cogliano playing more then 12 minutes a night?
- he is dynamite 4 on 4
- should be getting a regular EV shift
- a small role on Special teams (either on the PP or PK: these can't be any worse with him on them and he'll develop into a more well-rounded player).
Just a quick check at the NHL.com site. Says Cogs is getting 14:55 TOI/G and Moreau is getting 15:36 TOI/G. That isn't really that big a difference when you think Moreau is on every 2nd penalty kill (since he is in the box for the other one).
Also, Moreau's penalty numbers are worse from where I stand:
1.98 PIM/GP and 7.63 PIM/60
Moreau's PIM/GP is higher then SMac's and the PIM/60 is significantly higher then any none thug on the team. This is not a good sign, since Moreau is not a pest or a thug.
by B.C.B. on Mar 19, 2009 1:16 PM MDT reply actions
1.98 PIM/GP and 7.63 PIM/60
Moreau's PIM/GP is higher then SMac's and the PIM/60 is significantly higher then any none thug on the team. This is not a good sign, since Moreau is not a pest or a thug.
Taken, rate, differential - it all shows how bad Moreau is.
I agree on the conclusion, and it leads to another point: why isn't Cogliano playing more then 12 minutes a night?
Well, he can't start in his own zone because he can't win a faceoff, so that takes about 15 possible shift starts away from him. He can't play PvP, so that limits his home shifts significantly. And, to be honest, he's not showing that he should be getting extra shifts at center by the numbers, is he?
by Coach pb9617 on Mar 19, 2009 1:57 PM MDT reply actions
The problem is Gagner. They both play the same role: 2nd line center. Both are small, are not good at faceoffs, offensive minded, and can't play wing effectively. We have too many small 2nd line centers and no real third line shut-down centers.
I think he would be fine playing more EV minutes in a different role.
by B.C.B. on Mar 19, 2009 2:29 PM MDT reply actions
Which he would lose. Gagner is significantly better than Cogliano on the circle, and especially over the last month - Cogliano is well under 30%.
Cogliano needs to move to right wing, and quickly.
19-10-83
27-89-13
18-78-34
21-51-46
by Coach pb9617 on Mar 19, 2009 2:47 PM MDT reply actions
or
He needs to be packaged to bring back a serious offensive threat to either play with Hemsky on the LW, or play with Gagner and take some of the heat off the first.
I like your lines for this season. But I am basing this on hearing that Cogs prefers playing the left to the right (I don't remember where; but it was in relation to the Moreau waving Poo out of the circle incident).
by B.C.B. on Mar 19, 2009 6:40 PM MDT reply actions
FMNF is about all I can say at this point....
by shepso on Apr 1, 2009 2:59 PM MDT reply actions

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