I'll Never Make It As A Detective
As those of you who have been reading this site since its inception know, I am forever making references to two hockey books: Future Greats and Heartbreaks, by Gare Joyce, and King of Russia, by Dave King with Eric Duhatschek, because I think both do an outstanding job highlighting parts of hockey that are both relevant and rarely accessible.
Aside from that, anyone who was reading this blog back in April will know that I'm always very interested when a hockey book makes a reference to a player but doesn't give his name. One of my first posts was about such a player, nicknamed "the Fish" by Dave King, a player I'm quite confident I correctly identified - Stanislav Chistov.
Gare Joyce makes a bunch of similar references in his book to players, often without ever identifying who they really are. One of these is found on page 195 of Future Greats and Heartbreaks, a player that Joyce did a sample quote sheet on for the Columbus organization:
Junior coach: "Hard on himself- harder than we are on him a lot of the time. Very up and down emotionally. He's a hyper kid a lot of the time. He's had a couple of setbacks and he doesn't get over them quickly. They stay with him longer than they would most other kids."
A teammate: "He's in the gym all the time. He wants to watch video [of games] all the time. He thinks the more time he spends on the game, the better he'll be.
A former billet: "We had him our first year away from home [when he left to play midget AAA]. He went home after a month or so. He said he was homesick and I think he was. I also think his father wasn't real happy with [the son's] playing situation. Anyway, he came back after a time. He wasn't a bad kid- there weren't issues with the rules of the house- but he wasn't the most socially adept player we've put up, and we've put up kids from very small towns."
A coach who worked with him in a tournament: "It was a bad situation for him. We just had other players and I knew them. I didn't know him that well. I knew he had physical talent, some great skill, but I wondered about his game judgement sometimes. Of course, he was younger, but still, compared to other playes his own age, I don't think he was reading the game as well as he should have been- trying to do to much sometimes. I think that's a question that's still hanging out there."
Another source: "His father seems to be an issue."
The unnamed player was described as being a player that the staff in Columbus was familiar with; further, Don Boyd says that he knew the father could be an issue, making it all but certain that the player was Blue Jackets property for some time. He would also likely be a top pick, someone the scouts prioritized early on as a target.
I was reminded of this part of the book as I did research on Gilbert Brule for the series Wanye and I have been doing on him - the article that triggered my memory was from NHL.com. Here's some of the similarities:But Brule is a rare breed that combines toughness and talent, all packaged within a quiet, almost unobtrusive demeanor. Brule is almost shy, but engaging. He will answer every question with respect and courtesy.
He tends to speak only when spoken to and shies away from the spotlight, but he can send a verbal message when necessary.
Brule's last junior coach, Don Hay, is effusive in his praise of Brule. "He is such a competitive young man, he really wants the puck in critical times and that's not a skill every player wants," Hay said. "He wants to be the player that makes the difference."
What I've read on the various message boards (reliability of such information: questionable) indicated that Brule's dad was a possible obstacle in his playing career.
Further similarities are plain in a Randy Sportak piece from Noveber of 2004 (one we highlighted in Part 1 of the Brule series). Here are some choice quotes from Brule, and Don Hay, his junior coach:
Brule: "I don't want all that attention and pressure. I put enough pressure on myself already."
"I don't think bigger is better all the time. I'm not the biggest player out there but I can still take the puck off a guy."
"It's how hard you're willing to work and how hard you compete."
Hay: "We had to pull the reins on him a bit because he was taking matters into his own hands too often. He's starting to learn there's the right time to do it and there's the right time to walk away."
It all seems to point to one thing: Gilbert Brule is the player that Joyce was referring to. A player who puts a ton of pressure on himself, is socially awkward, but has a high level of drive and a near-obsession with the game. It's gotta be Gilbert Brule.
Update: Two readers have called me to task respecting the quote from a former billet. Their reasoning is that Brule played AAA in Vancouver, while living at home. Although I've yet to see any firm confirmation of this, it does seem extremely plausible, and the idea that Joyce would confuse AAA with Tier II Junior A seems unlikely; thus making my deduction less likely than I originally thought.
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by Randall Shermer on Aug 14, 2008 11:08 PM MDT reply actions
by Oilman on Aug 15, 2008 8:27 AM MDT reply actions
Hard on himself- harder than we are on him a lot of the time. Very up and down emotionally.
by Sean on Aug 15, 2008 8:41 AM MDT reply actions
When he played for the Quesnel Millionaires, presumably.
by Jonathan Willis on Aug 15, 2008 8:58 AM MDT reply actions
Still, interesting none the less. And very curious that the Oilers would take him on given that they just gave up on Pitkanen...
.. must be the Canadian factor.
by PDO on Aug 15, 2008 10:57 AM MDT reply actions
by trackstar on Aug 15, 2008 1:19 PM MDT reply actions
Secondly, how do we know that he never left his billets? The information about his career pre-Giants is not terribly easy to get at; are you speaking based on personal (i.e non-published) knowledge, or do you have some kind of link or published report to back up your point? Because if you do, I'd love to read it.
Thirdly: When the junior coach talks about his personality, I had taken his "hyper" comment to refer to on-ice play, where from everything I've seen and read about Brule's junior year it fits well. Do you disagree?
by Jonathan Willis on Aug 15, 2008 2:01 PM MDT reply actions
by trackstar on Aug 15, 2008 3:06 PM MDT reply actions
As for rhetoric, the definition I was referring to is "grandiosity: high-flown style; excessive use of verbal ornamentation" and using words like "appalled", "incredibly inaccurate", "unbelievable deduction" and the like meet the latter part of the definition.
As for questionable assertions, when someone anonymous makes definitive statements like "never left his billets" with out anything backing him, it's questionable. As questionable as someone publishing under his given name advancing the idea that those quotes relate to Brule. I advanced a notion that certainly would be false if you could provide evidence supporting your statement, and I have no problem admitting it's false if and when that evidence is presented.
Until that point, my conclusion (Hey!- I think he's talking about Gilbert Brule) may or may not be accurate, remaining just as tenuos as it was when I wrote it.
That said, the odds of Gare Joyce confusing Midget AAA with Tier II Junior A is pretty unlikely, so on further reflection, my conclusion is likely wrong.
I'll ask again: where is your information coming from about Brule's amateur career: personal experience or published material?
by Jonathan Willis on Aug 15, 2008 3:31 PM MDT reply actions
Call the Vancouver Giants (604)444-2687, do AS ABOVE.
Talk to ANY of his previous Coaches or Teammates to determine "Who is Gilbert Brule?" I doubt you did that.
Next time do your homework before you decide to write about a rediculous conclusion that has no basis in fact. People that read your blog would like to think that you are a credible source of information. On this conclusion regarding Brule, it is you who requires proof of your conclusion. The information you are quoting is in no way related to Brule and the logic you use to come to this rediculous conclusion is flawed and doesn't hold water. It is clear to me that you have made a mistake. If you make a mistake, write a retraction on your blog, not the comments. Its the only honourable thing to do.
by trackstar on Aug 15, 2008 4:16 PM MDT reply actions
Given that I don't exactly get paid for writing this, does my failure to conduct a full background check with phone interviews and the like really surprise you?
Next time do your homework before you decide to write about a rediculous conclusion that has no basis in fact. People that read your blog would like to think that you are a credible source of information. On this conclusion regarding Brule, it is you who requires proof of your conclusion.
Nonsense. This blog is what it is: my opinions and ideas based on my personal knowledge of the Oilers and nothing else. I'm a fan, as much as anyone else is, and I have yet to make a penny off of my work.
As for my conclusion, here's the exact quote:
It all seems to point to one thing: Gilbert Brule is the player that Joyce was referring to. A player who puts a ton of pressure on himself, is socially awkward, but has a high level of drive and a near-obsession with the game. It's gotta be Gilbert Brule.
Now, maybe I should have added a ",right?" after that last sentence, but this was only speculation, as my "seems to" comment should make clear.
As for being a credible source of information, all of my references are there to see- people can examine the evidence and come to their own conclusions. I've never claimed to have inside knowledge, in point of fact I never claimed that this conclusion was definitive!
If you make a mistake, write a retraction on your blog, not the comments. Its the only honourable thing to do.
As for mistakes, and retractions, I have yet to admit an error, or retract it. I said that I was "likely wrong", but you haven't convinced me yet that I've said anything inappropriate, given that it was all supposition in the first place.
As for where I write things, I'll decide that myself, thank you kindly.
I also notice that you have yet to answer my question.
by Jonathan Willis on Aug 15, 2008 4:30 PM MDT reply actions
YOU ARE REDICULOUS BEYOND COMPARE.
I gave you the phone numbers of some of my sources. Call them and you will get your answer. Tell them you are doing an internet blog article on Brule and that you want to get your facts straight. Because YOU DON'T! Do your homework like any responsible and credible writer would do! Otherwise you have NO CREDIBILITY!! Even as a part time hobbyist giving rediculous opinions using questionable sources of information, you should have at least some degree of integrity.
My sources are impeccable and will remain private.
by trackstar on Aug 15, 2008 5:17 PM MDT reply actions
by trackstar on Aug 15, 2008 5:40 PM MDT reply actions
Thank you kindly for that information.
by Jonathan Willis on Aug 15, 2008 5:45 PM MDT reply actions

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